Tuesday, December 16, 2008

Reader Mailbag!

Reader SC recently wrote to WWHM to share something odd that occurred while trying her hand at the online dating world.

You see, SC is an exceptionally brilliant and driven woman. So much so that she has earned her PhD, and, like most people would, she briefly mentioned in her personal ad that she had earned a PhD.

Who wouldn't? Hell, if I had passed the third grade or had the ability to change my own pants, I'd probably include that in my own personal ad. Anyway, SC didn't require respondents to have their own PhD, didn't mention what line of work they should be in, she simply mentioned it in passing.

Now surely most men would be secure enough with themselves to view SC's accomplishment with high regard, wouldn't they? Let's look at the response she received from a gentleman:

You should not state that you have a PhD on your profile. This could intimidate men. And if you choose to keep it on your profile, you may otherwise attract pretentious, egomaniacs who can quote you every line from Shakespeare.

Admitting that you have a PhD is not wise when searching for love. In fact, you shouldn't even mention it unless they ask. Such admission can steer good men away from you; believing that they may never be able to relate to you intellectually. When searching for love, one needs to be open minded. Be completely receptive.


Let's look at that last line again, shall we? Just for shits and fucking giggles.

When searching for love, one needs to be open minded. Be completely receptive.

I guess we don't need to ask him if he has a PhD, do we? Unless of course he has a PhD in the formulation of contradictory statements. Now, not to let a snivelling little insecure pansy-boy get a free slap at her, SC wrote back an appropriate response:

I don't want to date someone who barely made it out of high school, and I definitely wouldn't want someone in my life who didn't support or encourage me in my career.

Also, something for you to consider, you should probably not tell women what to do with their profiles. This pisses women off. Women do not like men who tell them what to do. The idea that a woman has to lie about who she is to attract a man is incredibly insulting, and the only kind of woman who would go for that would be a doormat, and I am not that kind of woman.


Touche! Next serve? Back to the idiot:

I though emotional love was primary to you--second to intellectual love. I'm sorry. I wasn't telling you what to do with your profile. (Ed note: Um, yeah that's exactly you did.) I simply gave my suggestion. I thought this was something you would understand since you're a professor; with a PhD that is. After all, a PhD means, Doctor of Philosophy.

If my constructive criticism comes off as "insulting" or "pisses you off", then I fear you may have to sit down a bit and find out why you've acquired this degree. Is your PhD degree a display or do you really know its meanings and purposes? Is it something you went to school for because you believe it would impress people or do you truly wish to put it into practice?

The number of academic degrees one possesses is irrelevant when it comes to finding a mate. You're a young professor so keep your mind open. You may become wise. I can tell by your response that your mind is not fully opened as need to be as a professor. It will happen.

Wow, he serves a heaping of condescension with his small, atrophied penis. Final serve back to SC:

You have no idea what you're talking about.

Well said SC, well said.

Any other off-site dating exchanges you'd like to share, feel free to send them in to WWHM for public mockery! And thanks SC!

101 comments:

Anonymous said...

I am a tall woman. Almost 6 foot. And many men are intimidated by that, even men who are taller. By this reasoning, I should not put that information into a personal ad, as men may be disuaded from dating me.

But wait, won't they notice at some point?

I always figured that a man who is confident enough in his masculinity to be seen partnering a tall woman is man enough for me!

And hiding my education in order to attract men who are intimidated by that? I mean, what happens when they find out? If a PhD, or whatever, is a deal-breaker, let's get that out in the open right away.

As a screening device it is certainly working for her - look what it weeded out already!

Weasel said...

Yeah, I don't think she's missing much.

Nicole said...

With all the crap of grad school, you should be wearing that PhD at all times!

Seriously, that man is so clueless. Methinks he's been rejected by too many smart ladies in the past? He needs a woman so open minded that her brains have fallen out.

Lynda said...

Anon... just so you know and have hope my oldest son is 5'8 and his wife is 6'. Trust me height didnt stop him... I'l be a grand mother in May... god help me!

This guy is a loser and SC can find someone alot better than this!

When I had a personal online I had my education cause lets face it.. I dont want Timmy who works at the gas station and only has 2 teeth in his head and cant put more than three words together in a sentence. He also appears to not have taken a shower in about a year...

I want someone who can appreciate my engineering degree. That Im willing to go to great lengths to get ahead in this world and not sit on my ass and collect welfare.

fleeting said...

Oh. Dear. God. I would have absolutely snapped at this guy. Kudos to SC for keeping it together enough for the snarky replies. I am absolutely horrified that there are people so ass-backwards and sexist in the world. I know that I've been attacked for being very clear about my ambitions and the fact that I wanted to date someone who was similarly educated. Apparently wanting to have conversations on the same level makes me an elitist bitch. Of course, it worked out that my boyfriend had only a high school education when I met him. (Now he has 2 year diploma) However, unlike this festering, raw blister of a man, my boyfriend respects my intelligence, has been encouraging me to do my PhD, and we have great debates about current events and philosophy all the time.

The best part of today's post was when Professor Dumbass explained what PhD stood for, because, clearly, women need that sort of thing explained for them.

archellebaker said...

Nothing is less attractive than unsolicited "advice" from a stranger. This guy probably thought, "hmm, I'll do something different and unexpected and that will shock her into my bed. What shall it be? Oh yeah, I'll lecture her over the internet about the true value of education, and pretty soon she'll be eating my cum off an oyster shell!" What a fucking moron. I would have been way meaner to that guy than she was.

connemaranz said...

I am on a couple of internet dating sites. I have spelled things out to the 'nth' degree but.......
"Independent and some what feisty when it comes to protecting the interests of those about whom I care.
I really enjoy scintillating, intelligent conversation which is not 'me' or 'ego' driven. Cannot be bothered with trying to second guess what people are thinking - I am not into mind reading, grunt interpretation or sulks. Say it up front and accept people for what they are. Into horses; so you must at the very least tolerate (with good humour) my responsibilities towards my equines.
I have come to the conclusion that realistically most of the (younger) guys on sites such as these are probably just trying to get laid. That is fine, each to their own, but just to let everyone know up front, I am not looking for a 'toy boy' nor casual sexual encounters.
Intelligence really counts. Common interests help. Sense of humour is definitely advantageous."

It says on my profile my age - 55 - and even with what I have written I still get more posts from apparently functionally illiterate 'toy boy' wannabees, than my own age. (still I guess as they appear functionally illiterate, their comprehension skills will be zilch anyway).
Seriously, I think I am just too intelligent for most of the dudes 'out there'. If guys really are threatened by an intelligent, educated woman would we really want to know them anyway?

Way back in the 70's before I met my DH (who had the effrontery to up and bloody die on me) I once said that I really wished I was gay as there were so many really neat women 'out there'. But I am not. In my society men seem to be like parking places; all the good ones are taken and the ones which are left are all disabled parking only.

colorisnteverything said...

Wow. Good to know that a PhD has this effect. I am still trying to get one and studying for my GRE anyhow. Glad I am with a guy who A. is getting one and B. isn't intimidated by the fact that I want one. He ENCOURAGES it. And yeah, I do appreciate that.

Sadly, I know several women who *are* PhD students that do not tell men they meet online what they are in school for because it will intimidate men. They wait until date 3-4 to break this information. It's actually rather sad.

Fleeting,

I get the "elitist" crap all the time, too. All because I say I probably wouldn't date someone who didn't at least have 1 college degree. I have big ambitions and am quite driven. While there *may* be a mature person out there without one, I doubt that person would be all that interested in me. When I go on a paper writing binge, I am rather intolerable and need space. BF understands that because he has been there. I am not going to bother him when he is going through essays all weekend, likewise.

connemaranz said...

Hey come on
didn't you know PhD equates to 'piled higher and deeper?
Or is that an antipodean phrase only?

fuglyhorseoftheday said...

What an insufferable asshat.

>>As a screening device it is certainly working for her - look what it weeded out already!<<

That is EXACTLY what I was going to say! It worked GREAT!

fuglyhorseoftheday said...

>>Way back in the 70's before I met my DH (who had the effrontery to up and bloody die on me) I once said that I really wished I was gay as there were so many really neat women 'out there'. <<

My lesbian friends tell me that when you date them, they are pains in the ass too. It is not the same as having them as friends. Sorry! :-)

RebelJubilee said...

great screening device indeed! Although, I have to notice that while he was dripping condescension and ignorance he did use correct grammar and punctuation.

And Weasel, could you have given me a better post to link my blog to? I've got all the asshattery already written out.

Dating Adventures from the Zoo

Mack Truck said...

I'll go you one better than that, Weasel.

I had a FEMALE friend tell me not to let men know how smart I really am, if I wanted to get a husband.

She said that I was too smart for my own good, and men don't like intelligent women. They want someone they can take care of, and whom they can feel superior to.

After I picked my jaw back up off the floor, I told her that ANY man who was intimidated by my intelligence was someone I wouldn't want as a life partner anyway.

Then I stopped being her friend. Stupidity like that probably isn't catching, but I wasn't willing to take the chance!

Dusty said...

Ladies, lets form The League of Elitist Bitches!

The moment I mention that I'd like a man with higher education, people look at me like they're planning on burning me alive.
So what if I'd like a man who actually uses his brain!?

SC, loved your replies to that asshat!

Anonymous said...

Go SC!

I'm a woman with a PhD and although I don't flaunt it, I sure as hell don't hide it either.

And, just so you know, I found a man that can deal with it. Don't let neanderthals tell you otherwise, you definitely can find men who actually appreciate and enjoy an educated woman :).

Anonymous said...

Oh, and we've been married for over 12 years. It's the most enjoyable relationship I've had in my life, and I've had a few. Nothing like having someone to get deep into topics with, debate with, and share similar views of the world with.

Keep that PhD right there in the personal ad.

Posie Rider said...

i am tall too... i'm dating a really short man. Is that okay? AND to top it all off I'm a feminist. JUST when you thought it couldn't GET anymore complicated!

Toodles x

Posie Rider said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
SC said...

Thank you everyone! I really did want to ignore his posts, but I couldn't let him get away with saying I shouldn't "admit" to having a Ph.D., as if it's a prison record or contagious disease. I am so glad this site is here -- I hope men read it!

Pilar said...

You know... I think it was John Fitzgerald Page who answered SC's personal ad!!

Mary said...

lol @ Pilar! SO true!!

You know, all the antics that men pull, I'm always expecting a laugh when I come to this page...this is the first time I've actually been MAD when I read the post! What a jerk, the dating page should let you red flag that guy.

I tried my hand at online dating and met my best friend (not lover) but I also met some REAL crazies...one guy posted borderline porn photos of himself, and while he had an absoluted fabulous physique, I sent him a No, Thanks note because I felt his ad was inappropriate. Apparently, he was insulted that a woman could look at him and not be completely floored, because he continued to email me (with no response from me) for three weeks about how rude I was to reject him- when literally, all I said was "Thanks, but I'm not interested" !!! WHAT? I thought I had the discretion to choose my own partner, by my own criteria????

Thingsthatperplexme said...

Amusingly, I just sent one of these to Weasel this morning...

I have also been advised to tone down my smarts. No fucking chance. I have worked way to hard on this PhD to be diminished by antiquated gender roles. Maybe that's why I'm currently single, but there's a few interested parties in the wings..

Then again, PhD does not equal professor, at least not in my field (biomedical science).. what an ass.

CaliGirl9 said...

Even though I haven’t continued my education to include a Ph.D., even mentioning that I have earned an M.A. has men looking at me like I’m nuts. (At my age it’s just not financially worth it to seek more education, and as I’m not some sort of research science type, I’d be paying for it on my own and I’m still paying for my M.A. What would fit is an Ed.D., but it really won’t increase my employability. I’d just be completing my master’s project to its logical conclusion. Strangely enough, my master’s project was about emerging adulthood, age 18 through about 25 and young men in professional sports—how to offer them guidance that they will listen to. It’s possible! Did you know young men can’t help themselves; their poor brains are chock full of immature structures and they have problems with impulsivity? Lol like it took scientists and psychologists years to figure that out!).

When I tell men that my M.A. is in sport management, they ask why I work as a writer and why did I bother to get such a strange degree.

Reasons for earning such a “strange” degree:

1. I wanted a bit of postgraduate marketing and business knowledge that did not require me to take the GRE (I am truly math-retarded).
2. I would like to work somewhere in sports in a communications capacity (not likely due to my sex or age). My undergrad degree is a journalism-based degree, and I also have an A.S. in registered nursing.
3. I wanted to have fun in an unexpected educational setting. I wasn’t that program’s typical student (20-something, fresh out of college and hiding out in grad school another couple of years to postpone adulthood, and eager to challenge my instructors with plenty of real-world questions.).
4. I wanted to attend a private Jesuit university (I’d never had any sort of private school exposure so I thought I’d give it a go.)

For some reason men don’t find any of those reasons reassuring. Why do I work as a writer? I get paid for it.

I do admit that I am intimidated by any person who has any sort of higher education in mathematics, physics or computer stuff. But I do find a smart man can be very attractive to me, as long as he’s not a total troll. I guess men define smarts in a woman to mean she watched football on Sunday and anticipates when he needs a sandwich and more beer, whereas women prefer conversations a bit deeper than “did you see that catch?” and “this beer isn’t cold enough.”

flaming_mo said...

Good for SC!

As someone now working on their Master's (and hopefully towards a Doctorate eventually) I applaud her willingness to tell the idiot off. I was once married to some passive-aggressive dingbat who lied from the get-go that they would be supportive of my academic ambitions. I was naive and foolish for thinking that love was all that mattered; as well as presuming that my partner's choice to not go beyond a high school equivalency (which is what I also had at the time, along with some community college) or secure some sort of vocational/professional accreditation would not be a long-term impediment to our relationship. I was wrong, wrong, wrong.

As irritating and condescending as that respondent was, he did her a huge favor by displaying his ignorance up-front and not wasting her precious time. Finding someone who is a secure-ego true partner can be a painstaking process; I congratulate SC on her willingness to be forthright and establish boundaries.

The sad part is the number of people, male and female, who harbor such archaic attitudes towards women who pursue a higher education as something other than a MRS. venue. Pathetic.

SassyBrunette said...

Agreed. If you can't be yourself in love when the hell CAN you be yourself? I don't think you should ever have to compromise or mislead people about who you are when you are looking for someone to have a serious relationship with! If they can't handle it in a personal ad, then they sure can't handle it in real life. Intelligent women deter stupid men, it's quite convenient.

SassyBrunette said...

I agree with Thingsthatperplexme...this guy has no idea what a PhD even is, no wonder he is so threatened!

emrlddragon said...

I admit, I'm a little on the heavy side, not fat really just short with a lot of curves... and a couple extra lbs.

When I go on dating sites, I don't start out by posting a picture. I always get a couple of replies saying.

Then someone asks for a picture. I post one, at which point I'm lucky if any of them tell me they are no longer interested.

Trainer X said...

Ugh, dumbass... *headdesk*

www.ihateyourhorse.blogspot.com

horsegal said...

*thanking my lucky stars again for my wonderful husband*

Loved your snarky comments back, SC. Way to go!!

Gawd, what a pig that guy is. No wonder he can't get a date.

Maybe Mae said...

I am a heterosexual female in a long-term relationship, but now I think I'm in love with SC. :) Awesome post.

Maybe Mae said...

Oh, also, I LOVE how it was evident from his email that he had to look up what "PhD" stood for. :)

clara said...

what a douche. who wants to bet that he is 45 and is flipping burgers at wendy's?

lamexicanita86 said...

The only gal this type of guy could stand to live with is Bertha the Cavewoman.

fleeting said...

I think part of why this makes me so angry is because one of my best friends dated a guy like this. He had basic high school but kept saying he would go back. When my friend got into vet school in the UK, he was very supportive, but the longer she was there, the more it was evident that he felt threatened by the fact that she was more educated than him, and that she would be making more money than him. They had a horrific break up full of passive-aggressiveness on his part, all because he wasn't man enough to deal with the fact that she was intelligent and pursing a career.

Ann said...

What happened to SC is absolutely true. A friend has a Engineering PhD and tries to meet people with masters or doctorates on a social site.

The men invariably turn her down saying it's hard enough for them to be in the academia, they need a supportive wife who makes the home and who doesn't expect him to support her in career, it's difficult to find a place for her at the same university etc. All kinds of excuses.

Men never look across the room while in the University, they are OK with marrying "downward".
Why, it's socially the norm and practically encouraged!

She seriously considers entering in a partnership with another woman.

Nurse Kitt said...

>>who wants to bet that he is 45 and is flipping burgers at wendy's?<<

I think you are slightly mistaken. I think he's 44, a virgin, and he has no job. He lives in the basement of his fathers and the only reason he has no job, is because he can no longer fit through the doorway.

People stop by and pay $0.10 to look upon The Most Pathetic Human. Only problem, is they often run away throwing up, because he hasn't showered in well over 10 years.

Alison said...

Another great device for weeding out the idiots, my fellow elitist bitches, is telling a man that you speak more than one language.
Especially if it's a European or Asian language.

Anonymous said...

1) It is unclear to me why stating she has her PhD means she's not open minded.

2) Several times he refers to her as a "young" or "new" professor. I don't know what the original post said nor what SC does for a living - but people with their PhD's do all kinds of things that do not include being a professor. He seems to make a lot of assumptions.

3) Like other women have mentioned here, I had a similar experience. While I was working on my master's my friend's brother told me not to tell men I was a grad student
-Why?
-Men don't like smart women.
-So I should play stupid - is that what you're saying?
-Essentially.
-What exactly do you suggest I tell them when they ask what I do?
-I dunno, tell them you're a stripper

BTW his sister (my friend)was working on her PhD...he was telling his own sister to act like a hooker to "get a man".

Kate said...

Did my friend Jamie write that, the self righteous asshole? I didn't mean friend either, I meant "guy I went to high school with that always had a crush on me, never got any play and gives me shit about having a masters while he lives in a car I gave him".

This isn't about me. But still, this is riduculous.

SC said...

Since you've all been so supportive about this orefice I should tell you about another one who wrote recently. He basically said, "I'm Jewish and expect to marry a Jewish woman. But in the meantime I am up for intimate encounters, so how 'bout it?"

I said no. Men are so dumb.

Anonymous said...

Ah, yes, the infamous "shiksas (non-Jewish women) are for practice" mentality. Jerks.

Weasel said...

Reading through the posts on this one, I thought I might put up an interesting statistic.

My stat compiler does a pretty good job of sorting through the demographics of WWHM readers, and over 66% of you guys have a college degree, and 15% have completed grad school. I know those are rough estimates, but in general, WWHM has a pretty smart audience. So I wasn't too surprised to see all the comments on here.

That's not to put down those who don't have a college degree, I know some fucking brilliant people who never went to college. In fact, a couple of the smartest people I know didn't even finish high school, and they're a hell of a lot smarter than I am.

Conversely, I've met some people that did go to college and thought to myself "How the hell did they get through college?"

I think educational status can be misleading, so sometimes people should be wary of using educational status as an ultimate "deal breaker." Some intelligent people never have the financial resources to attend college.

But yeah, if someone's life aspirations end at pumping gas or flipping hamburgers, that makes a lot of sense.

I got a degree from Arizona State University, and I'll be honest here- all I did in college was get drunk and play volleyball. I've never even used my degree. But I am glad I have it because a lot of women require that degree from a guy.

Anonymous said...

Wow. I have a guy who's turned on by intelligent debates. He likes it even better when I win. I didn't fully appreciate that before now. If you'll excuse me, I need to go give him a kiss and tell him he's sexy...

Sheri said...

He was very condescending and I got the impression if he was sitting next to her he'd be patting her hand and saying, "There, there dear. You will get it right someday."

Let's not confuse education with intelligence. Stating you have a PhD does not just signify intelligence but determination, persistence and commitment. Maybe it is those qualities that he considered would scare some men away.

What I find insulting is men who have to tell you about their wealth in an ad, or what a great car, house, boat etc etc they own the first time you meet them. To me it is insulting because it seems that they think all women are gold diggers out for all they can get. You reap what you sow.

fleeting said...

That's a very good point, Weasel. I don't think higher education should be a deal-breaker, but I think "passion for knowledge" should be. I think it's the best compromise, as you don't exclude people who could not afford extensive higher education, but you do exclude the tools who went to university so they didn't have to start paying rent.

Goldie said...

*snorts* I'm tired of men like this. It's not just brains or a degree that intimidate men, being a professional also freaks them right out. My friend and I are business partners, artists who travel and do shows for a living, and as soon as that nugget of information is dropped on a singles site...well, the dust trails of fleeing men tell the story.

Please, men of the world, we're begging you, grow a f***ing pair or six!

Calantha said...

As someone whose first boyfriend barely graduated high school and yet is one of the more civilized (albeit still immature) men I've met, I can agree that educational level isn't the best indicator to go by. I think it's if you take that and compare it to how they act when you see them, then you get a good idea of what they're like. If someone who didn't finish high school still has a fascination with the world and wants to learn, that's a good sign. Having a degree on top of that is better for all the reasons mentioned.

This guy reminds me of those sawdust-for-brains fleshbags who whine that boys will feel emasculated if they have to practice sports in the same room or on the same field as girls. They operate on the outmoded idea that ONLY the man should be able to run, jump, and get sweaty. They forget this is the 21st century, where everyone, regardless of gender (sex?), is allowed to be smart, well-read, a good soccer player, etc.

Anonymous said...

maybe im a tad backwards, but doesnt''deciding'' what you deserve, before you meet anyone raise some sort of ego maniacal, self serving, preservationist decision process that is the emotional equivalent of racism?by definition,'' i demand that you meet these requirements before you will even be considered'', whatever those requirements may be. in much the same way, douglas adams said,'' the megalomania of wanting to run for office and be in charge should, by itself, preclude one from being eligible for that office. theres a fine line between self esteem and self impressed

robyn said...

Hmm. I'm a nurse, went to a 4 year, very highly regarded university, have a Bachelor's degree in my field. But I dated one guy very briefly who broke it off with the rationale that he wanted to "date only professionals." Yay. I shoulda told him I wanted to "date only non-egomaniacs."

Asshat.

Liz said...

I have to believe that even the women in here that say they want a man with a higher education could appreciate a man who didnt necessarily have a PhD, but can still hold a conversation and be supportive of YOUR education[and obviously be somewhat financially stable on his own.] An asshole like that, though...I cant see why any woman would want him around, PhD or otherwise. Take pride in your accomplishments- I'm sure we're all agreed that any man who who finds your accomplishments to be a turnoff can find his way to the door.

& I, as other people have stated, would also have been much less kind than SC was to that scumbag. Bravo to your patience.


P.S. I love you guys. The comments are just as funny as the posts.

Nurse Kitt said...

The only problem I find in potential male mates, is that they never seem to qualify as "men" to me. The guys who are either intimidated by the fact that I'm working towards a higher education to a well respected and well paying job, or think I should lie about who I am and what I plan to do, are what I call "boys".

They never grow up enough to actually sit down and wonder why they haven't met a female that they can actually sit down and enjoy. Either they are too "intimidated by the females" or they appear to be bored by the less educated females. And the ones in between eventually come to the conclusion that they don't have to be a doormat for the rest of their lives, dump said guy and get a higher education anyways.

It's time for boys to grow up and realize they don't live in junior high, when you can pick your nose and yell "cooties!" and intimidate everyone around you.

P.S. Boys - just because your boss calls you a "Master at flipping burgers" isn't quite the same as actually getting a Master's degree in college (I had a guy try to debate that with me once.. Oy vey!)

The Half-Assed Blog said...

I have been told to act stupider to attact guys.
I'm not giggly or smiling all the time. I use bigger words in conversation. I like talking about interesting things.

And that scares the hell out of men, apparently.


It's just not worth it. I refuse to be something I'm not for the sake of a date.

lamexicanita86 said...

Dead on, Weasel. I am currently in college and have frequent encounters with "very smart people" (including honors students and Oxford graduates) who are about as pleasant and intelligent as this guy. On the other hand, I also know some "losers" with nothing more than a high school diploma who are highly intelligent and earn far more than many Ph.D's. I still love the joke that Ph.D stands for piled higher and deeper, even though I know a fair number of people who contradict that rule.

Anonymous said...

This reminds me of an ex boyfriend of mind. He once condensingly patted me on the knee and said "No sweetheart, there's no way your iq is higher than mine." His rational; when he was nine years old in primary school, he was accepted into an enrichment program. And he graduated high school doing the easiest subjects available. Apparently those two achievements trumps my higher high school score (doing the hardest subjects) and a bachelor degree. Also working in a dead end job in telephone sales trumps working for one of Australia's latest companies in a professional, middle mgmt role.
Loser.
I think it took me about one month after that to break it off and leave him a sobbing, heartbroken wreak.

Anonymous said...

I don’t give damn what qualifications a person has - I’ve been out with some gorgeous guys of all levels of education. Lordy I like a man who is good with his hands. ;)

I don’t talk about my university quals unless asked about it because basically I never think about it - bit like a drivers license, I only drag out it out if some asks to see it.
I rarely talk about what I do either -mainly because I hate getting into a long conversations talking shop and having to EXPLAIN what I do in my time off .
When a guys finds out eventually I’m a research scientist - meh no big deal they have all thought it was “cool.”

Whether a person has been to uni or not is not a reliable indicator of toolness or asshattery though.

SC’s replier is just some sad old fuck trawling for women 20 years younger. It is the language of someone with his head stuck in the 1950’s.
“Such admission can steer good men away from you” clearly he‘s intimated but he ain’t good.

Anonymous said...

Good heavens... Now we know why SC has a PhD and the dude doesn't. Pity, for one rather "articulate" he sure exemplified arrogance to the nth degree. Talk about being "open-minded" (doesn't "open-mindedness" include being "non-judgmental"?). Humm...

Lynda said...

I was told by my MOTHER after my divorce that no man would want me because I had three kids... That I ruined my chances of having a good life... thanks mom!

She tried to hook me up before I ever got married to a cop in town. I said no way! A few years later the cop got diagnosed with Leukemia and died. She told me gee you should have hooked up with him you'd be a rich widow... (do I have to wonder why my mother married my dad... um no... he owned his own business... )

Ive also been told by male friends that Im too "independent"... that no man will stay with me long because of that... and that Im too smart too.

Well Ive been in a relationship now for 8 years. No I dont plan on getting married again. He has a high school degree and is a CNC Machinist and I have a manufacturing engineering degree. I work for the federal goverment... we seem to get along pretty good. Kids are almost grown now. Of course my mother use to nag at me when I weighed 125lbs and 5'5 that I was fat... well now Im 45 years old and I am fat... that is something I need to work on though. Not good for my health. But my horse's butt is still bigger than mine!

misskitten said...

good gods. o.O

i'm intelligent, but went the high school to marriage to motherhood route. i'm divorced (twice as of today). i'm engaged to a wonderful engineer who doesnt give a rats ass about my lack of degree because i can *still* hold up my end of a conversation. he also delightedly declared my profession as "permanent arm ornament" to his coworkers...

which amuses us since i'm 45, short, plump, and walk with a cane. and he doesnt care a whit for any of that other than i adore him. good for you SC in that you ran off this waste of your time!

Amy.mangos said...

With all the work it takes to get a PhD, I agree with Nicole that she should wear it around her neck if she so damn well pleases!

I met my guy online. His picture was from his first semester at a very tough engineering school- full, unruly, ratty beard, greasy hair from not having time to shower all week, and a truly depressed 'smile'. His ad stated that he didn't think he'd meet anyone online but his friends made him put up a profile as a lost dare, and anyone not looking for a sad, lonely, chubby engineer should not bother writing.

I WAS looking for another sad, lonely, chubby over-achiever. We've been together almost 4 years. He's less depressed now.

Moral of the story: Honesty is ALWAYS the best policy!

jax said...

maybe i'm weird but i dont need your high school transcpits or a GPA to find a date. nor would i want to be judged by my own.

maybe its the romantic in me but what happend to finding good guys,regardless of their educational stature? there is a lot of really amazing guys out there that barely finished high school.

Thingsthatperplexme said...

I personally need a guy that can keep up intellectually and needs to have a fast wit and rapid-fire banter. I don't care if he has a high school degree or a PhD, but I find that few men with just a high school degree don't have the wherewithal to keep up with me. At least a few college classes under their belts indicates to me that they're willing to learn or think about learning. I guess I'm just an elitist ;)

cattypex said...

This man is obviously living in a sitcom.

She pretends to be dumb, he pretends to be educated.

Hilarity ensues!

cattypex said...

"WHAT? I thought I had the discretion to choose my own partner, by my own criteria????"

Mary, that's why there are soooo many evil violent stalker exes out there. They just don't believe their "bitches" DO have that right!

anniebanannie said...

Yeah... I dated a lot of guys who thought I was wonderful until they found out how smart I am(was). It ended up that I was the dumper or the dumpee. Now I'm married to the greatest guy who likes my brain as well as my other attributes.

Evergrey said...

Be open minded- act ignorant and dumb, because that's how women should be!

Hah. Hahah. Ahem.

If I want something pretty that I can fuck but can't have an intelligent conversation with, I'll buy one of those blown glass designer dildos. I wouldn't even have to hide it when my friends came over like I had to with my idiot ex who thought that anime physics were real.

cattypex said...

THANK THE POWERS that my family values education so very highly, and that we're all pretty smart.

My sister, who is creeeeeeeeepy smart and very pretty, stayed single all thru HS. Her line (at age 15) was, "You're just not erudite enough."

Funny, we both married guys without college degrees, but really intelligent self-educated types. Who appreciate our humor.

I never got the "act dumb" line. Mostly because guys were staring at my boobs, I guess.

"Boys are dumb. Throw rocks at them."

Another good line: "Don't be a GUY, Lloyd. Be a MAN."

yay real men!!!!

Anonymous said...

I am a bisexual man who is PhD-bound and I have noticed firsthand the different ways men and women will respond to your educational status and ambition.

I have never felt like I need to hide or obscure my education or intelligence around a woman. Regardless of her own attributes in those respects, I have found that women almost always find them to be appealing qualities in a man.
This having been said, all the women I have been involved with in the past have been preeminently brilliant and I would have it no other way.
The majority of my personality is my intellectuality. It's not something I turn on and off; I feel that I am always very cerebral and the closest intimacy is only ever possible with someone who can partake in that.

Men are much trickier, I find. I have met a good number of educated men who show interest up to the point that I start discussing my own education. I am also more reluctant to put my intellectuality out there and I find myself (falsely) acting a great deal more giggly and vapid than I ever would with a woman.
It's a complicated dance.

Certainly, though, I have to agree with earlier comments that education does not equal intellect. I have met any number of people who think their degree makes them some sort of genius but whom I have found to be sorely lacking in any stimulating intellectual conversation.

I think that SC was wise to put her PhD in her profile and that it will attract that rare breed of man who thinks that nothing is sexier than the title "Dr."

P.S. - Boys are not stupid and rocks should not be thrown at them. I find comments like that to be degrading, presumptuous, and far too blatantly misandric to be thrown around lightly.

ginmar said...

"Misandrist." Oh, GAWD, spare me. You can bitch when women make up half of Congress and we've had 22 female presidents. That's not misandrist: it's known as sarcasm. Men don't face this attitude:

"When a man does something stupid, people say, 'Isn't he stupid?'

When a woman does something stupid, people say, 'Aren't women stupid?'"

Welcome to what women go through every day.

cattypex said...

Sorry Anon.

That boys/rocks quote came from a T Shirt I found amusing.

I was, in fact, trying to differentiate boys from men. Or, if they're over ... 30? .... GUYS from MEN.

You, sir, are a MAN.

Smarts is sexy. As in, critical thinking skills.

So is education, formal or not.

My non-degreed artist brother-in-law likes to say "I've got my 'college knowledge,' and I've got my Discovery Channel knowledge'!"

Sorry for the knee-jerk statement. Should've provided context.

cattypex said...

Hey, I was comment #69!

heh heh heheh heheheh

Posie Rider said...

As a tall woman, I find it a positive pleasure to wear heels. As an intelligent woman, I find it a duty to make this apparent, especially on dates. The fact that I have a right to do both of these things is so beyond the point that I daren't state it here, on a forum so crowded with intelligent people.

So, best stupid date moment yet.
(My date, Terry, has been talking for half an hour about his incredible business acumen. I, Posie, finally interject.)

Posie: But Terry, talking like that, don't you worry that people will think you have a terrible ego?

Terry: Well, don't you worry that people will think you're pretentious when you use such big words?

Posie: 'Ego' is a three letter word, Terry.

So is 'Bye'.

ladiesalone.blogspot.com
xxx

cattypex said...

*worships Posie*

When my sister was in a near-fatal accident, she went to court against the trucking company whose driver caused it.

At her deposition, the judge, their lawyer and HER lawyer (all men) had to keep stopping and asking her what those big ol' words meant.

Sooooo........ if for some reason I ever do the dating scene again, Posie, I will ask you for a list of awesomely quelling one-liners.

And use words like "abstruse" and stuff.

Anonymous said...

I didn't mean to belittle a woman's burden by my accusation of misandry, Ginmar. I apologize for making an issue over a throw-away line, but I cannot let it rest.
But, quite frankly, welcoming me to a "woman's world" in the same post as telling me to bite my tongue certainly sends mixed messages. No woman should ever have to bite her tongue; too long has she been told to be silent in the face of her oppressors. I don't want anyone to be oppressed; I don't want anyone to be degraded.
Just as I hope one day my daughters will just tell off anyone who degrades them, I hope too that my sons will do the same.

When I hear comments like "Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them", I think of all the times I have been presumed devious simply because I was a boy, all the times I have been mocked for showing emotion, and all the hindrances to accepting myself as essentially selfsame to both women and men. Phrases like that might be thrown around in good humour, but they reiterate the divisions that stop us from understanding one another-- that stop us from not just raising our daughters like sons, but our sons like daughters.

Ophelia said...

Mmh. My BFF is a brilliant woman with a post-graduate degree. She's beautiful, she's a published author, and she's lonely in her romantic life; because guys find her intimidating.

I have only a college degree (for you Yanks, that's 'technical college'), I'm only moderately good-looking (no horrifying disfigurement at least ;) ), and not particularly bright overall. But I have hobbies that are not typical "girl" hobbies: I play video games, I build model kits, I read books in foreign languages. And I'm lonely in my romantic life because guys are, apparently, intimidated by me.

I think it's less a matter of education and intelligence than an attitude of "I don't actually NEED you in order to live a fulfilling life", that frightens these men away.

ginmar said...

Anonymous, the fact is, women have to deal with shit that you can't imagine. And we're talking about what guys do to women. You didn't mention the gender of the people telling you those things. I kind of think they were men, though you probably remember the women better. Men enforce the rules for other men. You can't imagine what happens to women who get out of line. I have a blog. I get hate mail---at my house---and stalkers. I get death threats and rape threats. I also get guys complaining about misandry and trying to change the subject from women to them. They're so uncomfortable with women talking about men that they want to shut us up. They can't handle the slightest joke or criticism before they start calling women man haters.

Back on topic. I like to tell guys to guess what I do. I'm five foot four, fairly small, and have shoulder blade length curly hair.

I'm an interrogator/linguist with the US Army, I served in Iraq, and I was in combat. I speak two other languages. I've been to about twenty different countries.

The guys I served with are pretty comfortable talking about shit with us women, and it seems to help them to know they can talk to us about stuff. There's a high percentage of guys there who are the sons of single mothers and they're used to strong women. It's interesting because you don't expect to find such liberal guys in the military.

Anyway, nobody's yet successfully guessed what I do. It's kind of funny; I've been confronting guys on my block when they blast their stereos and they're just totally unprepared for a woman who won't back down. Just standing up to a guy is enough to get you called a bitch, among other names.

"Boys are stupid. Throw rocks at them." aroused great protest. Think of all the tee shirts aimed at women, or featuring women as sex kittens advertising stuff. Hell, look at the guys in these ads. No matter how ugly they are, they want a supermodel. Some of them have whined and bitched about it, too.

bhm said...

Cat,
I use to edit a post-modernist journal so I can provide words and sentences that can make a Ph.D back off. One of my famous lines is, "If I hear deconstruction one more time I'm going to shoot somebody".
--------------
cattypex said...

*worships Posie*

When my sister was in a near-fatal accident, she went to court against the trucking company whose driver caused it.

At her deposition, the judge, their lawyer and HER lawyer (all men) had to keep stopping and asking her what those big ol' words meant.

Sooooo........ if for some reason I ever do the dating scene again, Posie, I will ask you for a list of awesomely quelling one-liners.

And use words like "abstruse" and stuff.

December 22, 2008 6:19 AM

bhm said...

ginmar,
Agreed. You're some gal!!

bhm said...

Isn't "Boys are dumb. Throw rocks at them.", the name of CNJ's new mare.

ginmar said...

I like really feminine stuff, too. I have a tiny pink lap top computer. I get lots of "Aw, what a cute little computer!"

It just cracks my shit up to ask them if they want to see the medal that I got for combat.

Why is it that guys can't hold supposedly opposing concepts in their minds simultaneously? Keeping in mind the definition of guys versus men. Before I joined the military, I was a ballet dancer. I know some really amazing women.

Amazing guys, though, often don't brag, like genuine nice guys--as opposed to Nice Guys. Nice Guys are the ones who are all friendly with you and stuff, but they expect to get laid as a reward for being your friend. Funny, my girlfriends don't expect that, even the ones who are gay.

One of the most intelligent, sensitive--not emo, by the way---and well read men I ever knew was the garbage guy who picked up the garbage for a shop I used to work in. He was a guy who liked to fix up stuff and sell it, so he had a tidy side income. He was just happy with humility, even though he had a lot to brag about. Alas, some smart woman snapped him up.

I've never been into wealth and that crap myself, being a huge geek who values good bargains, old things, and stuff like that, so I don't have a problem with guys who are happy with some humble job. It takes a lot of character to go, "No, I'm happy." Guys are still expected to be the providers. You'd think they'd be overjoyed at all these independent, ambitious women---stay home and keep the house if you want to, guys. Some of them, though, still expect to be waited on, even though their partner might have the high powered job that pays the bills.

My ex boyfriend was a nice guy---not that bright, but nice. Instead of being intimidated by what some guys call 'feistiness'--ick!---he used to call me "Killer" and warn other guys, "I'd knock that off if I were you. I don't know if I can hold her back." We switched off cooking and chores, and it was great, but kind of smothering; we lived together in a verysmall flat.

Anonymous said...

The older I get, the more I notice the sinister effects of pervasive, sexist societal attitudes on people like that original doofus. In other words, men are considered intelligent, with or without a degree, and having a woman, who is only considered intelligent WITH a degree, ask that a man BE DEGREED is implying that she wouldn't consider degree-less men "smart enough".

But, how can that be??? EVERYONE knows that guys don't need degrees to be SMART! Only women need degrees to be SMART! OMG! It must be an "elitist bitch"!!

Ella said...

You know what, people suck. It isn't how others treat you but how you treat others that should define your life. You shouldn't have to hide yourself to find love- a man, or woman, should love you for who you are. ALL of who you are.

Anonymous said...

So...his response generated not one, but (at least) two responses from SC, in which she willingly followed his lead in the communication and even felt the need to get in the last word after he had openly insulted her. (If this post constitutes the sum total of their correspondence.)

Little fishy, meet the worm. Obviously she was interested. It's just not believable that she would respond twice to a guy who was insulting her if she didn't care about his opinion.

If this was the way the exchange ended, chances are that the reason he didn't suggest they meet for a drink was that he decided that SC was fun to insult but he wasn't interested in fucking her.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
octopod said...

"Obviously she was interested. It's just not believable that she would respond twice to a guy who was insulting her if she didn't care about his opinion."

Do you seriously believe that?

If so, I'm curious how many restraining orders have been issued against you in the past.

.ae. said...

Obviously she was interested.

No, sometimes you just have to tell a person how fucking stupid they are, even if you know, you know, they just aren't going to get it.

And as a person plodding through her dissertation right now, I can very confidently say you don't get a PhD purely for display purposes.

Anonymous said...

you may otherwise attract pretentious, egomaniacs who can quote you every line from Shakespeare.

Two things:

1) If you're going to take a condescending attitude toward a woman who is obviously smart, at least have the decency to do it with proper grammar. This guy needs to revisit how to use a COMMA before he starts throwing out semicolons (incorrectly).

2) Guys who can quote every line of Shakespeare are both sexy and rare. Personally, I would love to find one who isn't a grandfatherly, 60+ year-old professor. Of course, I have my Masters in English, so that could just be me... :)

I just think it's funny that this guy tried to encourage her to take down her educational information by telling her it might attract, GASP, someone who is intelligent and well-read.

Head, meet desk.

WinterMusic said...

Oh, this makes me so mad! I don't have a requirement for a minimum educational level in a guy, and I don't think it's fair that he should have what is essentially a maximum education requirement for me! It makes me remember when I was in my little country Catholic grade school (think so small it didn't have a gym and was next to a cow field), where several teachers told me point blank that "boys are just smarter than girls" and "if you're so smart all the time the boys won't like you". Girls were expected to get the minimum amount of education and then get married and have babies. Thank goodness my family didn't share this viewpoint and encouraged me in my pursuit of higher education. Now, since it's mostly women in my field, I unfortunately see many boyfriends that are having trouble with the woman surpassing them in terms of education. What these guys don't get is that most of my female classmates don't care about what degrees the guy does or doesn't have. They want a partner who shares their passion for learning, who will at least try to understand their ramblings instead of saying, "OK, yeah, that's great honey. Can you get me another beer?" I personally don't care what the guy's educational level is, but I REFUSE to hide my accomplishments just because they might intimidate some guy. I've worked hard to get where I am, and if you can't deal with that, I'm not dealing with you. End of story.
Good for you SC!

Antithesis said...

Peniswrinkle McDouchefacewhat do you do for fun?
and why are you single?

Me
See profile.
And I am not single.

Peniswrinkle McDouchefaceYou're profile is soo long, and why does it say available if your "seeing someone"?
after going thorugh all that trouble to make your profile so built up, you missed an important part, lol.

MeI did not. It says "Available," not "Single."

Peniswrinkle McDouchefaceYeah, but theres also an option for "seeing someone" as which a person youre case should have checked.
Avaliable is for whores who are dating, have a bf/gf or husband/wife and still are available to fuck around.
Single is people who are single for everyone
Seeing someone is for someone who is dating a b/f g/f orhave a husband / wife

MeSeveral things:
First of all, when one is "Seeing someone" or "Married," but still looking for dates, OKC classifies one as "Available."
I have a girlfriend, and am not available to f*ck around, but I am available to date other people. I am polyamorous, as I very clearly state at the top of my profile.
I am not single. I am available. Unfortunately for you, though, I only court the literate.

Peniswrinkle McDouchefaceSo you're a whore. You want many people. Thanks for clearing that up, I was wondering why I was having such a hard time getting through to you but I guess all those diseases finally got to your head.

Anastasia said...

Above dialouge between me and Peniswrinkle McDoucheface occured regarding the following profile:

http://www.okcupid.com/profile/Antithestasia

xenobiologista said...

The people who are saying SC should date women just because she ran into one idiot on a dating site are being dumb too, unless they're kidding. If we accept that gay people are born gay that means straight people are born straight too...with the exception of the small minority who are bisexual or otherwise.

I know lots of lady professors and scientists (in the USA it means someone who has a PhD but isn't a professor or in some other high position, as far as I know) who are married or dating. There is NO problem with being a professional and finding men...except that it might take a while if you look in the wrong places.

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Hammerhead said...

Damn, this guy has no idea how the whole "relationship" thing goes, does he?

My parents met when they were both working at the same college. They both have PhD's and my dad, who's an attorney, actually passed up a job at a larger law firm so that he would have more time to spend looking after me while my mom worked on her dissertation. They've been happily married for over 20 years and still sometimes act like newlyweds.

Now THAT is love, dickhead.

Anonymous said...

Women hate men out of jealousy. Women care for no one but themselves and blame men for every problem they encounter.

Men suffer more poverty, more drug problems, more alcoholism and more homelessnes. Women dont care about anything that doesnt concern them. More money is spent helping women than men or children, whic i find disgracefull. Children should be our number one priority, and it must be noted women are responsible for more family breakdowns than men, more child abuse, child neglect and child deaths. But as always they get more lenient treatment when caught.

As a group in society i have no respect for women because they do not respect me or my body as they request men do of them.

Women can also act extremely childish when breaking up with partners, and i can only see them as overgrown children in need of rich men to pamper them.

Anonymous said...

Anon, please tell all of those things you just said to your mother and make a video on youtube, and please tell your father what you think of your mother. I hope they both kill you. That being said, what an idiotic thing to say. No one on this forum has even moderately suggested that they wanted any man to take care of them. In fact, quite the opposite. And actually I don't even know why I responded to you because nothing you said was true. Women make less than men in the exact same fields. You claim that women don't care about their children when the last I heard there was an epidemic of single MOMS while the children's fathers are off getting drunk in mexico. In fact every marriage I know of that broke up was because of an unfaithful asshat dog of a "man" not unlike yourself.

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Anonymous said...

Jedną pośród dziedzin, które obecnie mają niezwykle ważną rolę
na rynku gospodarczym jest rachunkowość.
To ona jest odpowiedzialna za ewidencjonowanie zachodzących wydarzeń gospodarczych
na rynku, jakie mogą być wyrażone w wartościach
pieniężnych. Ona też stała się obiektem zainteresowania wszystkich
przedsiębiorców, jacy postawili się na stworzenie swojej działalności gospodarczej.
W końcu wszyscy z nich są zobowiązani do rozliczeń
z instytucjami państwowymi, jako element
gospodarki krajowej. Ujmując ją jako dziedzinę
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Anonymous said...

Rachunkowośc to dziedzina, w którą nie zagłębiają się
raczej zbyt często osoby, jakie nie wiążą z tym własnego doświadczenia.
Ogólnie rzecz ujmując, rachunkowośc nie będzie w zasadzie branżą,
a takim systemem ewidencjonowania zdarzeń gospodarczych, jaki ma ująć w wartościach
finansowych wszystkie operacje toczące się w tej konkretnej jednostce działającej na rynku.
Ustawą rachunkowości są objęte bez wyjątku wszystkie
jednostki gospodarcze zajmujące się procesami produkcji,
dystrybucji oraz konsumpcji i akumulacji
towarów. Ewidencje rachunkowe odbywające się w biurach rachunkowych będą miały odzwierciedlić zdarzenia mające miejsce w jednostce gospodarczej na rynku gospodarczym.
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Anonymous said...

Jeśli przyjrzymy się bliżej branży, którą jest rachunkowośc, możemy
potwierdzić, iż ma ona wyznaczony konkretny cel w istniejącej gospodarce.
Generalnie właśnie to ta ma na celu wytworzenie prawdziwego obrazu majątkowej sytuacji, w której są konkretne podmioty na rynku.
Podmiotem zainteresowania tej dziedziny, jaką jest księgowość, są także wszystkie operacje finansowe, jakie miały miejsce na rynku a także działalności i jednostki, jakie mogły brać w
nich czynny udział. Trzeba pamiętać, iż w zasadzie każde takie zdarzenie gospodarcze ma
wpływ na sytuację gospodarki państwa.
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Anonymous said...

Na dzień dzisiejszy rachunkowe biura nie muszą narzekać na zbyt małą liczbę zainteresowanych klientów.

Zgłaszają się do takich przede wszystkim właściciele
firm, którzy mają niewielkie firmy. Takich osób jest na dzień dzisiejszy na rynku naprawdę dużo.
Zakładając oraz obsługując na własną rękę działalność, nie można o wszystko zatroszczyć się osobiście.
Mając to na uwadze korzystają oni z możliwości proponowanych na rynku, które okazują się świetnym wyjściem.

Pewną z dziedzin, jaka obsługuje takie firmy jest właśnie rachunkowość proponująca
oferty księgowe, która musi czuwać na zgodnością finansów w firmie.
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Anonymous said...

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Wszystko z racji na fakt, że o wiele więcej ludzi decyduje się na stworzenie prywatnej działalności.
Takie rozwiązanie staje się dla sporej ilości ludzi nadzwyczaj zadowalające, ponieważ oczywiste jest, iż wygodnie jest stać się szefem dla samego sieci.
Co prawda z prowadzenia własnej firmy wynika dużo obowiązków, jakie pociągają
do odpowiedzialności każdego przedsiębiorcę. Szczególnie gdy chodzi o podatki.
Jednak, wówczas jeśli korzysta on z ewidencji dobrego biura rachunkowego, to nie musi się niczym martwić.
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